Why don't People like Tables

daygon · October 27th, 2006, 01:12 PM

I wanna know why people dont like tables. They're less of a hastle than css and esier to keep stuff organized. I do agree css is good but really its only good to make whole site changes in one sweep unlike tables. So why does everyone hate tables with a passion?

ukgeoff · October 27th, 2006, 01:26 PM

Tables are for tabulated data. They were never intended to be used as a layout tool.

Designers started using them back in the early days of the Internet because they wanted the sort of control with their layout that they were use to getting in print.

Back then, hacking around with complex table layouts was the only way to achieve it.

Then along came css and set us free. Once you get use to using divs as your main structure tool and margins and padding to position things just where you want them, you will find that your pages are a lot cleaner, code wise, almost certainly less weighty (Kb/page).

Pages done this way are more friendly for people using assistive technologies as well.

mreine · October 29th, 2006, 03:03 PM

Don't fight the force young Jedi, learn to use the power of the css force and defeat the darkside of tables.

moojoo · October 30th, 2006, 10:02 AM

To sum it up

cleaner source code
faster load times
more accessibility
easier maintenance

EngAdven · October 31st, 2006, 05:28 AM

You just need to see how the visibly impaired use screen readers to view websites and you’ll soon understand why you can’t use tables for layout.
With a reasonably coded CSS layout the screen readers make perfect sense of the sites but with tables for layout they just try to read the design information on each page and it becomes complete nonsense.
It’s like building flights of stairs to stop wheel chairs getting into buildings.
Gary Molton

Accurax · November 1st, 2006, 10:04 AM

In my country we say that using tables in a website is like letting a monkey fly a plane....... verrry dangerous

JacobHaug · November 1st, 2006, 11:38 AM

hahaha...lol

chubbs · November 1st, 2006, 12:29 PM

Borat is that U????.... lol.....
BTW first i used tables as well, now im using xHTML and CSS, its much easier!

crewdesign · November 1st, 2006, 02:07 PM

hee hee i love Borat. I think tables are a "bit bad" for SEO aswell as they reduce the amount of content to design on a page

bruno89 · November 1st, 2006, 11:26 PM

personaly i like tables BUT! thats couse i dont know any css i find tables do what i want them to do and i dont realy have any intention to lern css or anything else at the moment so ye just a personal veiw

daygon · November 2nd, 2006, 01:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bruno89

personaly i like tables BUT! thats couse i dont know any css i find tables do what i want them to do and i dont realy have any intention to lern css or anything else at the moment so ye just a personal veiw

See and you porbly dont have any problems with your site and its has a fluid layout and no overlaping layers.

moojoo · November 2nd, 2006, 01:30 PM

You are missing the point, sure tables work but the idea is to separate the design from the content. This makes it lighter, more accessible, easier to maintain, easier to modify/correct, printer friendly with a print style sheet, more functional for disabled users etc etc..

The table/no table debate is an old one that won't go away any time soon. But simple fact is correctly built web sites yield better results, better SEO and better user experience. Tables are not evil but they were also never meant to be used for layout.

bruno89 · November 3rd, 2006, 08:29 AM

at the end of the day i only make websites for myself i dont make them for anyone els and sure i dont have any problems with my site untill i delete the rong bit of my code and ye well im not a profesional like most of these guys and one day i will lern css becouse of the seo and all the other bol*** but ye i dont have time right now so if u have the time lern css i mean whats the harm in that ? i know im gona lern it wen i have time to lol

moojoo · November 3rd, 2006, 10:30 AM

If you are doing it for yourself then it doesn't matter what you use. It could be 50 frames and 800 nested tables for all any one cares. There are times when tables are called for and times they are not. Think of it like this. Say you were making a gaming site then you could acceptably use tables because it is safe to assume that the users of that site have updated computers, are not blind or handicapped in that way and more than likely use higher than 1024x768 as a screen res.

bruno89 · November 4th, 2006, 03:33 PM

lol yes but im thinkin of doing a couse oneday lol i enjoy makin websites so why not do it as a job? lol iv bin lookin into the hole thing and a few people have recomended itskills but I DONT! there a rip off BIG TIME! i mean £7000 to do the course and the staff are usless web designers? i mean take www.psoftuk.com thats the head of webdesigns website ...........

JacobHaug · November 4th, 2006, 04:00 PM

I would NOT take this class if this is the head of the department’s website. He is clearly not that good, using Frontpage and tables...and admitting that he does within his source code. I would recommend a different class, or taking something online, through video tutorials.

mreine · November 5th, 2006, 01:35 PM

Bruno, no way to be subtle about this so I'll just say it.

You are one misleading and confusing individual. I may have the misfortune of reading the garbage coming from your keyboard, but at least I have the ability to know it's garbage and allow it to pass by without harm. Some people may not realize this about you and maybe my post here will enlighten them.

You notice my sig line? Well, it's something I highly follow because giving advice relies on this very foundation. If you expect people to listen, then by god you better follow that same advice being dished out.

Telling people you use tables and how they work just fine then saying you only do sites for yourself is the biggest pile of donkey doo I've heard. Why even bother typing that? First of all, it's an outright lie based on just a few of your posts.

http://www.webforumz.com/html-forum/...-are-on-my.htm

If the site was for yourself, why are you concerned about how many people are on your site? You fail to understand that not using tables isn't for the creators benefit. It's for the visitors! DUHHHHH! The site may be YOUR site, but you will have visitors and THAT'S the part that matters.

The behind the scenes benefits of not using tables and using css are simply a bonus for the creator.

So... does working on your sisters website also apply to only working on your own sites. I guess the order form is only for you to use? DUHH!

http://www.webforumz.com/html-forum/...for-needed.htm

You need to think before you speak Bruno and realize you are dealing with other people here. The advice you give could be followed if somebody who knows better doesn't step in and correct the situation.

bruno89 · November 5th, 2006, 02:36 PM

if u dont like what i rite dont read my posts? "DUHHHHH!" and the hole howmany people on my site thing was to experiment with different things..
the hole order form thing is now gone and i do only make sites for myself..
i just let the veiwers look at it....
"DUHHHHH!"

mreine · November 6th, 2006, 12:35 AM

eye will reed and reply two wat u rite two mak sur othr peeps no wat u rite is crap.

Tardbot Translation: I will read and reply to what you write too make sure other people know what you write is crap.

heh

daygon · November 6th, 2006, 02:35 PM

I did not mean to start a whole war within the forum all i wanted was a simple questions answered. I'm just going to say that i use both and ill mix them from time to time, but only if its sites for myself and not for sale. I prefer to make my personal stuff look a little more simple than my clients. And let my samples and previous sites speak for themselves. Once again thank you guys and keep on codeing.

(y)